Comments on: The tenacity of hope http://www.lesbiandad.net/2008/11/the-tenacit-of-hope/ notes from the crossroads of mother and father Thu, 29 Jul 2010 16:27:27 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: genderkid http://www.lesbiandad.net/2008/11/the-tenacit-of-hope/comment-page-1/#comment-292878 genderkid Wed, 26 Nov 2008 21:40:53 +0000 http://www.lesbiandad.net/?p=776#comment-292878 "Spem ei dare debes." (That better be right, or my Latin teacher will kill me. I just finished my fourth year in secondary-school Latin.) I don't know how to accurately portray "gotta" or " 'em", though. Ok, enough nerdiness; I like the way Harvey put it the best :) “Spem ei dare debes.”

(That better be right, or my Latin teacher will kill me. I just finished my fourth year in secondary-school Latin.)

I don’t know how to accurately portray “gotta” or ” ‘em”, though. Ok, enough nerdiness; I like the way Harvey put it the best :)

]]> By: Lesbian Dad http://www.lesbiandad.net/2008/11/the-tenacit-of-hope/comment-page-1/#comment-292823 Lesbian Dad Wed, 26 Nov 2008 15:41:15 +0000 http://www.lesbiandad.net/?p=776#comment-292823 Yeah, <b>Shane</b>, I read <a href="http://aberrantclone.blogrrr.com/2008/11/the-enlightened-v-the-ignorant.html" rel="nofollow">this piece, "The Enlightened vs. The Ignorant,"</a> by Frank, the straight twin of <a href="http://www.pamshouseblend.com/userDiary.do?personId=147" rel="nofollow">Fritz</a>, a gay man who's a diarist at <em>Pam's House Blend</em>. The nice couple Frank writes about seems in absolutely no way interested in (or in his view even capable of) breaking from their view that (a) the state is an arm of the church, and (b) homosexuals have no place in any institutions of that state. Or certainly this one. Misguided sinners that we be. Yet pretty much everyone agrees that one of the most critical dialogs, from those who care about this issue, will have to be with both faith leaders and congregants in those faiths that preach heterosexist views of the civil sphere (across multiple faiths and races). Churchgoing rates were -- I believe -- the number one determinant of how one would vote on Prop 8 in CA, next after that age. I am not affiliated with a community active in this dialog (my spiritual community is essentially constructed around <em>belief</em> rather than <em>faith</em>, and its political branch seems to be focussed on global peace issues -- though at least I found <a href= "http://www.bpf.org/html/samesexmarriage.html" rel="nofollow">a statement</a>) but I'm very impressed by <a href="http://church9.securesites.net/marriage/" rel="nofollow">the California Council of Churches'</a> writings on the matter. Don't know their work. Many more have been doing a lot of work in recent months and years -- <a href="http://www.soulforce.org/index.php" rel="nofollow">Soulforce</a> springs immediately to mind, and the <a href="http://www.equalitygiving.org/Homosexuality-Religion-Politics" rel="nofollow">Interfaith Alliance</a>; <a href="http://www.noonprop8.com/about/who-opposes-prop-8#FBO" rel="nofollow">a ton of faith-based organizations</a> actively (often feverishly) supported the No on 8 work in CA -- and I hope they find interest and support from a lot more of us in this next education/outreach phase of the civil equality battle. <b>Genderkid</b>, thank you for finding us these words of Milk's. Wow. (Would that I actually knew Latin enough to quip "You gotta give 'em hope" in that language.) Yeah, Shane, I read this piece, “The Enlightened vs. The Ignorant,” by Frank, the straight twin of Fritz, a gay man who’s a diarist at Pam’s House Blend. The nice couple Frank writes about seems in absolutely no way interested in (or in his view even capable of) breaking from their view that (a) the state is an arm of the church, and (b) homosexuals have no place in any institutions of that state. Or certainly this one. Misguided sinners that we be. Yet pretty much everyone agrees that one of the most critical dialogs, from those who care about this issue, will have to be with both faith leaders and congregants in those faiths that preach heterosexist views of the civil sphere (across multiple faiths and races). Churchgoing rates were — I believe — the number one determinant of how one would vote on Prop 8 in CA, next after that age.

I am not affiliated with a community active in this dialog (my spiritual community is essentially constructed around belief rather than faith, and its political branch seems to be focussed on global peace issues — though at least I found a statement) but I’m very impressed by the California Council of Churches’ writings on the matter. Don’t know their work. Many more have been doing a lot of work in recent months and years — Soulforce springs immediately to mind, and the Interfaith Alliance; a ton of faith-based organizations actively (often feverishly) supported the No on 8 work in CA — and I hope they find interest and support from a lot more of us in this next education/outreach phase of the civil equality battle.

Genderkid, thank you for finding us these words of Milk’s. Wow. (Would that I actually knew Latin enough to quip “You gotta give ‘em hope” in that language.)

]]> By: Shane http://www.lesbiandad.net/2008/11/the-tenacit-of-hope/comment-page-1/#comment-292781 Shane Wed, 26 Nov 2008 14:05:29 +0000 http://www.lesbiandad.net/?p=776#comment-292781 Okay, I tried to read it, honest I did. I even made it to the 2nd page before I thought to myself "Are these people for real?". Then about mid page three I answered that question inside my head. Unfortunately not only are they real, they are many. They are the ones backing these hate-filled laws nation wide with their time and money. They are intent on keeping us, the LGBT population of the world, from obtaining equality because they honestly believe that their Almighty Diety wants it that way. Sacry stuff! Okay, I tried to read it, honest I did. I even made it to the 2nd page before I thought to myself “Are these people for real?”. Then about mid page three I answered that question inside my head. Unfortunately not only are they real, they are many. They are the ones backing these hate-filled laws nation wide with their time and money. They are intent on keeping us, the LGBT population of the world, from obtaining equality because they honestly believe that their Almighty Diety wants it that way. Sacry stuff!

]]> By: genderkid http://www.lesbiandad.net/2008/11/the-tenacit-of-hope/comment-page-1/#comment-292686 genderkid Wed, 26 Nov 2008 11:22:18 +0000 http://www.lesbiandad.net/?p=776#comment-292686 Whoa. Thanks for sharing that video. I read part of wikipedia's Harvey Milk article and I found this gem that reminded me of Prop 8: "**Even if gays lose in these initiatives, people are still being educated.** Because of Anita Bryant and Dade County, the entire country was educated about homosexuality to a greater extent than ever before. The first step is always hostility, and after that you can sit down and talk about it." It's easy to imagine the words "amor vincit omnia" coming out of Milk's mouth. Whoa. Thanks for sharing that video.

I read part of wikipedia’s Harvey Milk article and I found this gem that reminded me of Prop 8:

“**Even if gays lose in these initiatives, people are still being educated.** Because of Anita Bryant and Dade County, the entire country was educated about homosexuality to a greater extent than ever before. The first step is always hostility, and after that you can sit down and talk about it.”

It’s easy to imagine the words “amor vincit omnia” coming out of Milk’s mouth.

]]>